SUMMARY KEYWORDS

drink, husband, wine, people, sober, alcohol, partner, home, feel, beer, talk, stop, boundaries, months, night, jealous, podcast, red wine, thought

SPEAKERS: Casey McGuire Davidson + Gill Tietz

00:02

Welcome to the Hello Someday Podcast, the podcast for busy women who are ready to drink less and live more. I’m Casey McGuire Davidson, ex-red wine girl turned life coach helping women create lives they love without alcohol. But it wasn’t that long ago that I was anxious, overwhelmed, and drinking a bottle of wine and night to unwind. I thought that wine was the glue, holding my life together, helping me cope with my kids, my stressful job and my busy life. I didn’t realize that my love affair with drinking was making me more anxious and less able to manage my responsibilities.

In this podcast, my goal is to teach you the tried and true secrets of creating and living a life you don’t want to escape from.

Each week, I’ll bring you tools, lessons and conversations to help you drink less and live more. I’ll teach you how to navigate our drinking obsessed culture without a bus, how to sit with your emotions, when you’re lonely or angry, frustrated or overwhelmed, how to self soothe without a drink, and how to turn the decision to stop drinking from your worst case scenario to the best decision of your life.

I am so glad you’re here. Now let’s get started.

Hi there. If you’re listening to this podcast, I’m betting you’ve been going back and forth for a while now on whether or not you should stop drinking. And I want you to raise your hand. If you’ve had any one of these thoughts.

You might have been thinking, I’m not that bad. I actually don’t want to stop drinking completely. I just want to drink like a normal person. Or maybe you come home after work. And you think I know I shouldn’t drink tonight. But I literally can’t relax or have fun without it. It’s really common to say I’ve tried to take a break from drinking before. But it’s just too hard. I always give up anyway. So what’s the point in trying again? Or here’s one I hear all the time from women. Everyone I know drinks. If I stopped drinking, I will be bored. Or I’ll be boring. I’ll have no fun. I’ll never be invited anywhere. I’ll just sit home and be miserable. Or maybe you can insert whatever your reason is there.

So is your hand up? If it is that is totally okay. And that’s because taking a break from drinking and changing your relationship with alcohol. This shit is hard.

And that’s why I’m really pumped to invite you to my completely free 60 minute masterclass the five secrets to successfully take a break from drinking, even if you’ve tried and you failed in the past.

After you take this free class, you’ll realize why what you’ve been doing up until now hasn’t been working, and what to do.

Instead, we’re going to cover all the juicy topics, including what questions you need to stop asking yourself, because they’re setting you up for self sabotage, not for success. We’re going to talk about exactly what you need to do differently. So you can stop the exhausting cycle of stopping drinking and then saying screw it, and starting again.

And we’re going to talk about the real reasons you haven’t been successful. And I’m betting they’re not what you think they are. And this isn’t surface level stuff. I am handing over the strategies and the mindset shifts I go through every day with my private coaching clients. If you’re listening to this podcast, I really encourage you to take a moment and sign up for this completely free masterclass. It will help you on your journey to drink class and live more to feeling better. So if you want to save your spot, go to hellosomedaycoaching.com/class while the class is still available, and I really hope to see you there.

Today we’re talking about living with a partner who drinks when you’re sober.  

And I know this is a big important topic for a lot of you because so many women were drinking buddies with their partners or their partners are resistant to getting alcohol out of the house or they don’t even want to ask, and that’s something that I struggled with too. So my guest today is one of my favorite people, Gill Tietz. You probably know her because she’s the host of The Sober Powered Podcast. And she was also on an earlier podcast of mine, she was on Episode 56, which was all about what you don’t know about alcohol and your body. It was a great episode. So if you’re interested in listening to that, just go to HelloSomedayCoaching.com/56. Well, Gill, I’m so excited to have you on the show today. Welcome.

 

05:24

Thank you for having me back.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  05:26

I know I’m really excited. And one of the reasons I wanted to have you on this episode is because I know on your podcast, you interviewed your husband, and had an episode about what his perspective was like and what your relationship was like. And I interviewed my husband as well on mine. So I think that’s really interesting. Because I have kids, you don’t have kids yet, but both of our partners drink with us. And we had sort of different relationships. So I thought it would be a good perspective.

 

05:58

Yeah. And it’s a topic I get asked about all the time is, what do I do when my husband drinks? We’re drinking buddies, like you said, it’s all we do together? You know, what am I supposed to do while he’s drinking?

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  06:11

Yeah. And there’s so much wrapped up in that, right. I mean, I know for me, I was jealous. When he drank in the beginning, I was like, pissed off, I wouldn’t buy him beer for the entire first six months, I’d be like, dude, if you want a beer, go by yourself to the grocery store, like, I’m not getting it for you. And now we’re fine. And I have no problem buying him beer. But I’m in that aisle anyway, buying my Athletic Brewing Company and a beer. But it is something that people struggle with. And then having alcohol in the house is really tough when you have a weak moment. So start us off. I know you teach this. So talk to me about navigating that relationship.

 

06:54

Yeah, I was so jealous of my husband, he used to make me so mad. Because we would be drinking and partying together. And then he would switch to water and take good care of himself. And he didn’t understand that it was his responsibility to make sure that I switched to water too. And I used to get so angry with him. Like, why aren’t you helping me, I thought it was his responsibility to help me moderate my drinking. And I used to, like suck him into my moderation strategies. And, and I would be so envious, that he could drink and do whatever he wanted, and then wake up the next day and just live his life, where the next day I would just be destroyed, I’d either have a hangover, or I’d be so ashamed of myself and, and so humiliated that I just be like hiding on the couch all day, and he just never seem to have any problems.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  07:51

That’s crazy, we were the exact opposite. Because for me, I would be pissed off, if like, I would have a bottle of wine, he typically drinks beer. And they’d be like, Oh, I’ll have a glass of that bottle. And I would be so annoyed with him quietly seething, because I’d been like, now I’m gonna have to open a second bottle. You’re such a dick, because I’m not going to have enough. And now we’re making it awkward, right? It’s your fault by having a glass that I now have to open bottle two. Or like, I’d wait till he went upstairs to like, open the second bottle and quickly pour myself glass and like, jump back on the couch. So I definitely did not involve him at all in my moderation strategies. Or tell him how crappy I thought because I didn’t want him to say anything about it.

 

08:39

Yeah, that’s a really good point. My husband never said anything to me about my drinking. He did one time towards the very end, which I can tell you about in a second. But for my whole drinking, he never said like, I think you might have a problem. I think you’re drinking too much. Or when I tried to talk to him about it, like suggest that I cut down, he never had an issue with it. He just thought what I was doing was normal. And he thought the only issue was how badly I felt about myself afterwards.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  09:10

Oh, wow. So he didn’t think you had a problem at all? Because I do hear that sometimes that the spouse isn’t like you’re fine. What’s the big deal?

 

09:19

Yeah, you don’t drink that much. You know, whoever drinks way more than you are. You’re doing just what everyone else is doing. And I was drinking a lot. I was drinking every day. But he thought that adults just grow up and drink every day. And it’s normal to do that. So I never had him telling me like I think this is wrong what you’re doing. He thought, you know, yeah, try to moderate, you can do it.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  09:44

Yeah. I mean, my husband never told me he didn’t think I had a problem. But that was because I never mentioned that. I thought I had a problem. He was sort of in the, you’re an adult. I’m an adult. It’s not my job to tell you what to do. Because I wouldn’t like you to tell me what to do, you know? He sometimes gave me an aside, when I was like opening bottle number two, he was like, What are you doing? You know, or like, asked me how I was feeling the next day, you know, or said he couldn’t wake me up on the couch. But like, yeah, I never was like, Do you think I have a problem? Because I was like, so deep into like, Dear God, do I have a problem? I better like get a hold of this.

 

10:24

Yeah, I thought that I did. Probably like two, maybe three years before I stopped drinking. That’s when I had been questioning it for a few years before that. But like two to three years before I stopped, that’s when I started thinking like, are you an alcoholic? He started having those thoughts. And I would ask him, and he, he would always validate me. No, you’re fine. It’s just after you drink. That’s the problem, all the self hatred and shame. And he’s like, if you could just figure out how to not do that. You’d be fine.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  11:00

That probably kept you drinking for a while. Not that it’s his fault in any way. But I hear that a lot that they’re sort of asking people do you think I have a problem and the most common knee jerk responses? No, because we have such black and white thinking about like, either you’re a quote unquote, alcoholic, or you’re fine. And you just need to exert some more control.

 

11:25

Exactly. Yeah. And that’s what we talked about when he came on my show about like, enabling and kind of, like keeping me there, or like, not that it was his fault. It had to get bad for me to really become aware. But yeah, he did enable me because I would try to have days where I didn’t drink. And like sometimes I would say, okay, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, I’m not going to drink at all. And then Monday, he would come home from work, and he’d be like, I’m in the mood to party. He’d be like, do you want to party tonight? Do you want to go out? And what am I gonna say? Like? Yes, yes. I would love to. I’m dying to drink.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  12:05

Yeah. Yeah. No, that’s interesting. So, I mean, I think both of us have similar and then different perspectives on drinking. Like, my husband would always say, like, you know, do I wish you wouldn’t pass out on the couch? You know? Yeah. Do I wish you would, like it was just understood that like, he would drive places? No, I would drive everywhere. And then he would always drive home, always. And sometimes I was like, completely, you know, useless. Driving home, like I would like fall asleep, quote, unquote, in the car on the way home and like, he’d have to pay the babysitter and like, put the kids to bed or whatever it is. So, you know, he was like, it was so weird, because he went from being so competent, and organized and everything to just completely unable to do anything after you drink, you know? And I was like, oh, yeah, I guess I did that.

 

13:07

Yeah. And that’s funny. He wishes that you didn’t have to pass out and blackout. But, and this is something I hear a lot too, but they don’t really want us to stop completely. No, they just want us to rein it in. Yeah. Because it’s a huge part of our identity, like going to parties or going out on dates and drinking or going on vacation and drinking or going to wine tastings. And like it was our hobby that we did. So he didn’t want me to stop. He just wanted to meet it. Not, you know, I don’t know, be so dramatic about it, like just drink like he did and move on.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  13:45

Yeah. And I think part of it, too, is like just not only your, or society’s idea of like, either you’re an alcoholic, or you’re not, or you’re fine, right. And you need to get to that point. But also, there isn’t a great example, at least in our friends group of people not drinking, and like continuing to enjoy life and have all the social situations. I mean, I think the fear is you’re gonna stop drinking and be unable to participate in lots of things that you used to enjoy as a couple versus just sort of tweaking them a little bit or taking some time to hibernate, which is kind of what what I think about it, like you sort of hibernate or you build your bubble in the early days, until you get a little bit stronger. And then you get out more and more.

 

14:36

Yeah, and I didn’t want people thinking that he was married to some kind of alcoholic loser because all of a sudden, I’m going to show up to his family stuff, sober, and I didn’t, I didn’t want you know, my sobriety to be a bad reflection on him.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  14:56

Which that’s, that’s deep, you know.

 

15:01

Yeah, I really, I really thought about, like everything anyone could possibly think about me not drinking.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  15:06

Yeah. And I think that’s really common too, right? I mean, it’s kind of funny because there was no question that his family knew I drank a lot. And when I think back, I’m sure they were happy that I stopped drinking, you know, just because, you know, all the things I remember, you know, this was separately about, like, my husband’s parents relationship that was a little bit contentious. But like, I went to his house for Christmas one year, and they had just gotten a new stove. Like this was like a big, you know, big deal in terms of needing to be installed before they hosted Christmas. And so we were hanging out and I spilled red wine on my white shirt. And so his mother, like, jumped up and was like, Oh, my God, I’ll wash it. And I was like, dude, forget it. Like, honestly, I was like, Dude, I have so many shirts. I’m like trash because of this, but I was like, oh, no, it’s fine. You know, we were like young and newlyweds. So jumps up, insists on taking my shirt. And it’s like, putting it on the stovetop to wash it with like bleach or whatever it is. And then his father gets involved. And they’re like, arguing about what’s the technique to get red wine out of this shirt. And then the pot boiled over and ruined the stovetop because of the chemicals in it. And we literally did not have a working stove for Christmas. And my mother-in-law, like it wasn’t a disaster of about, it’s like what the fuck is going down? I was like, we’re not talking about it. We’re, and in my mind of like, this is because I drink too much, right? Like Christmas is ruined because I drink too much.

 

16:39

Oh, that’s exactly where I would go to and then my entire time would be focused around that, that I’m a loser. I ruined Christmas.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  16:48

Yeah. But I was like, and can I get more wine? Like, do we? How do I suddenly pretend that there’s nothing to see here? So I can ask where we can open the bottle of wine, even though the stove is trash? Yeah,

 

17:03

I just spilled mine like I need, I’m out.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  17:08

We filled it up. All right, so let’s say you have decided you’re taking a longer break from alcohol. Let’s say you’re like shit, I gotta stop drinking. Maybe I am not labeling myself, maybe I’m not saying forever. But like, I can’t keep going on like this. And your partner drinks and there’s alcohol in the house. And there are a lot of different things around. Some people don’t want to talk to their partner about it at all. Some people are like, this is my problem. Any of those scenarios, you’ve decided to take a break from alcohol, and your partner’s not sober. What do you think is the first step that people should take?

 

17:49

I think the first step is to tell them. So I took a 90 day break before and then I drank again. And then I quit for good. But when I took my 90 day break, I told my husband, I said I’m not drinking for 90 days. And I said that and I told him the day that I was gonna drink again. So he knew I’m not drinking for all of these days. And then we talked about, you know, like how he can support me. But I think letting them know, to avoid what he was doing before when I was trying to not drink Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and he would come home like I’m in the mood to party, he would still do that if he didn’t know I was on a break. And that would be really hard for me to say no to when he’s basically giving me permission to drink. So I think telling your partner is really important. I know that can be really scary for some people because they don’t want to fail in front of their partner. If they drink again, they don’t want to feel like a failure or have them like rub it in or something. But I think telling one person helps just for accountability and safety. And then you can talk about like boundaries or whatever. But did you tell your husband right away?

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  19:07

I did. And I did not tell him anything except for the fact that I was taking a 100 day break from it. I had hired a sober coach but like did not tell him that and I didn’t tell them how worried I was about alcohol or how many times I tried to control it. But I did say, I said okay, I’ve taken a 100 day break from alcohol, from wine. And so then I literally, I was like, health kick, want to lose weight, whatever. But then I said so I don’t want you to bring home wine and I don’t want to have any in the house because I used to call him from work having a crap day and be super grumpy. And he would come home with dinner and a bottle of wine because he knew that cheered me up. He knew I was like, Oh, yay. You know, like you get that like Pavlov’s dogs. You’re happy even when you just see it. So I had to Tell him that, you know, don’t bring it home. I don’t want it in the house. And I think I even told him, I really want to do this. So if I’m like, Oh, screw it, will you remind me that I want to do this? You know?

 

20:12

Yeah, same. I also asked him to not drink wine around me or bring wine around me. And he would have, if we didn’t tell them, they would have done it because wine made us happy. It had for many, many years consistently. So why wouldn’t they continue to support that behavior and bring it home? We went to a casino somewhere in like the 50s or 60s. And we had had that plan since before I took my break. And I was trying to like bargain my way into drinking. Oh, well, you know, I was never supposed to stop for good. Like, the intention is always to drink. Again, this is just a break. So maybe like I was really going for it trying to get him to, to like buy in. And he reminded me, he was like, you really want to do this thing. And if you drink at the casino, it’s going to be easier for you to abandon it and drink a second time. And I’ll not drink with you like we’re gonna do it. And if he didn’t know, I probably would have drank that night. And then felt horrible about myself and you know, start the whole cycle. So they do help at least one person, it could be a therapist, like you had a sober coach, but telling the people you live with so they don’t like, try to give it to you.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  21:35

Hi there. If you’re listening to this episode, and have been trying to take a break from drinking, but keep starting and stopping and starting again, I want to invite you to take a look at my on demand coaching course, the sobriety starter kit.

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Yeah, no. And you know, I know a lot of people whose spouses would not have done that right would not have talked them out of it. For whatever reason, you know, whether they were like psyched that they were going to drink or psyched that it was going to be a party night or like you’re an adult, do what you want. I never thought it was that big of a deal. Or you’ve taken a 60 day break. Yeah, you deserve a drink. My husband probably would never have said no to me because I kind of said it before and then asked him to bring home wine or said screw it. 

 

So I really needed my coach as like an external voice and I kind of like planned out everything. But it was really important that my husband knew and I actually had to tell everyone, not tell everyone but when I was going out like I was going out to a girlfriend get together we always drink a ton of wine pretty early in sobriety like within the first 10 days. And my coach was like don’t go and I was like I have to go this girl like is one of my best friends moved away to a different state. And she’s back for this one weekend. You know like I can’t act though, in my mind. Now of course I tell my clients do you really need to go? But I like, texted when my girlfriend’s in. Same thing said, Hey, I’m on a health kick. I’m not drinking wine. Please, even if I asked, don’t give it to me, like, just just don’t, because you know me, I’m gonna break down, basically. And I got there and I did not drink for the first hour and a half. And then I finally was like, fuck it, can I have a glass of wine? And my friend Karen was like, No. And I was like, What do you mean? No, she was like, you told me to say no. And I was totally annoyed, and so glad, you know, after the fact when I drove home sober.

 

25:35

Yeah. And that ruins it. Like when someone’s like, No, you can’t you said you were going to do this. Like, then the barrier to drinking is so much higher, because you’re like, I did like you’re reminded it makes you pause. Or even if, like, if my husband had given me permission and been like, yeah, you know, you did 60 days, like, that’s pretty good, whatever that would, like, Ignite me to be like, No, I’m doing the 91st Psychology. Oh, nice. Yeah, having those conversations I think it really helped. And I think it

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  26:09

helped, like, you have to tell your partner, you don’t have to tell them why or whatever. But in the same way, like, people are like, Oh, I’m gonna do a whole 30 or whatever, you know, whatever it is, you usually tell your partner, if you’re trying to do something, health wise, or I’m gonna run everyday in January, you know, whatever it is. So telling them is big. And then I think knowing is your partner, someone who is going to support you, or someone who is going to let you off easy, or even someone who’s going to try to sabotage you, consciously or unconsciously kind of lets you know, do you also need external support? Because sometimes you do.

 

26:51

Yeah, definitely. And just seeing the truth about how they’re going to react, or you can tell like, when you explain to them, you’re not going to drink for however many days or months or whatever, like, you can tell by their reaction, and pay attention to it. Like, can I go to this person when I’m having a weak moment? And like, I’m trying to talk myself into it? Or would they, you know, talk me into it more? Or are they going to? If I slip up or something? Are they going to make me feel even worse about it and say like, I knew you couldn’t do it. So you have to know who your support is? Yeah. And like who your safe people are? And luckily for me, my husband is a safe person.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  27:33

Yeah, yeah. Now, I think that is incredibly important to know, because you really do need people who are going to cheer you on, and encourage you. And you know, even though my husband would usually, you know, he would never tell me what not to do. I could go somewhere and tell him, this is really hard. That was like my code word for like, I want to drink. But I’m not going to write not like, Oh my God, I want to drink. I didn’t say that. Because he would have been like, does she want to, does she not? But I would be like, This is really hard. And he’d be like, Okay, why don’t I go to the bar and get you something? And he would like, keep coming to me with non alcoholic drinks. And he was proud of me. I mean, he even told me he was, but you know, I don’t think he would have been the person to like, be like, No, you know what I mean?

 

28:26

Yeah, and that’s why the code word helped. And, like, you have to figure out how your own partner works. And like the best way to get what you need and, and like, not be enabled or like, allow them to talk you into it or something.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  28:41

Yeah, one of the interesting things that I wanted to ask you about this is, you know, with my husband, we’d always drink together, we got together when we were like 22. And I stopped when I was 40. So that was many, many years. And because I love to drink, it was part of pretty much everything we did. So I think he not only did I have a ton of fears about not drinking and what our relationship would be like and who I would be without it. I think he had equal numbers have fears about what our relationship would be like, how would we have fun? What would I be without it, you know? And so part of what I think help was saying 100 days, and not talking about forever to kind of ease us both into Oh, we can still go on dates, and we can still have sex and we can still enjoy each other. It’s different, but it’s still good.

 

29:40

Yeah, cuz it’s scary for them too. Because I met my husband when I was 22. Also, yeah. And yeah, it’s, it quickly became our only hobby. And it was, it was the focus of every vacation every date night every night at home like it was the focus of every single day was drinking And when we stopped or when I stopped Sorry. It’s like, what are you doing now? Do we go out and like look at each other? Like, where do we even go? Like, we can’t? We used to go to wine bars, like where are we supposed to go now? So we can’t go to that wine tasting every week, though. Like everything changes. And yeah, it is scary for them too and that’s why some partners like, maybe don’t react in the best way that we hope or they try to talk you into. You’re not that bad. Yeah, because they like the routine and they don’t want it to change. And they’re scared to.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  30:32

Yeah, absolutely. And so I know that one of the recommendations that I always give people is to remove the alcohol from your house, because you’re going to have a weak moment, you’re definitely going to have times when you really want to drink and you know, even having that beat between, you can just go grab it versus I have to get in the car, go to the store, come back can be the difference between like keeping on going on day 22 or drinking for another week and starting over. But that is hard when you live with someone who drinks and I also am and I know a lot of my clients are our sort of people pleasers. They don’t want to rock the boat. They don’t want to inconvenience anyone else. So what do you do with your husband? Or what do you recommend?

 

31:23

Yeah, and can I just say, like, we don’t want to inconvenience our husbands by like, not having alcohol in the house, like, Oh, my God, I felt that way too. And it’s like, how was that inconveniencing him? Like, yeah, because

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  31:37

you’re like, third day, he deserves to drink at home. And it’s like, yeah, you deserve to have a safe house and not be like, tempt. You know, in my mind, it’s like, I’m trying to cut back on sugar. Yes. Let’s keep a birthday cake on the counter for six weeks, you know?

 

31:55

Yeah, exactly. So I asked him, Can we not have any alcohol in the house for three weeks? So again, like the time limit thing, so then, I mean, my husband was cool with however long, but I said three weeks? Can you not drink with me? Can we not have alcohol in the house? So I can get comfortable with this change? I just made it about me. And then after the three weeks, I said, Can you not drink wine around me? Because I already struggled with being jealous of him for being able to drink and like control himself and not hate himself afterwards. I didn’t want to watch him drink my favorite thing.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  32:36

Were you red wine, white wine or anyone?

 

32:39

I mean, I would drink any wine. But I like Rosae. Oh, okay. Yeah. Yeah, I would say but he liked red. So I drink a lot of red. Yeah. To drink with him. But you

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  32:51

know what I’m jealous of. I was a red wine girl. And I swear there are really really good non-alcoholic roses. Like, I don’t know if you are. They’re so good. I found so many. And like red wines. I’ve tried them like they’re okay. Maybe you know, if you get a good one. You’re like, No, it’s not bad. But it’s like bubbly growth A’s. Like, I’m like, are we sure this is not alcoholic? Like it’s pretty amazing.

 

33:17

Yeah, that is so weird. Because the whites and the reds are not as good as the bubbly roses. It’s like something special about that,

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  33:25

that are all sugar. No, not that. Don’t have sugar. But yeah. So that’s interesting. So what made you pick three weeks versus a month or whatever?

 

33:38

So I was listening to Craig Beck’s podcast, the happy sober podcast. Yeah. And I binge the whole thing in like, the first three days of sobriety, because I had to go to work. And I felt really bad about myself. And I was just, I put my headphones in, which is the signal like do not speak to me. And I just listened to his podcast, and he recommended like, three weeks don’t go around alcohol at all, because you know, it’s getting out of your body, like whatever. So I was like, Okay, three weeks. And that’s what I asked for. But it could be two or it could be four. I’m sure it’s very similar, but I just said nine because that’s what Craig Beck said.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  34:19

I think so I asked my husband to not have any wine in the house. I was never a big liquor girl at all. Like that literally did not tempt me at all. I would drink beer. And now I’m all about the non alcoholic beer. But like, it wasn’t the same as wine, like wine would just call to me. It was inevitable. So I was like, Okay, let’s have no wine in the house and I wouldn’t buy him any beer. If I could go back. You know, now I’m like, Oh, get all of the alcohol out of your house if you can, but I wasn’t quite there yet. And because it worked. Like had it not worked, I think I would have had to ask him to get all the alcohol out of the house. But you know, I think that’s a little bit of like, Hey, if you try something, and yet you’re still drinking, that means you need more support, more accountability, whatever it is. But yeah, I definitely got the wine out of my house. 

 

And then I remember once, when I was somewhat sober, you know, meaning like, first two months, I came home, I open the fridge and there was like a bottle of wine in my fridge. And I was like, what, like, I felt like my space had been invaded, invaded, like, this was like, assaulting me physically, what is this doing here? And I said to my husband, I was like, What? No, I didn’t say anything for a day. And I was like, so pissed. Like, my blood pressure was like, over the top. And then finally, the next day, I was like, What is this doing here? And he was like, someone gifted it to me. I’m like, okay, it needs to go away. And he was like, Okay, so the freaky guy went out on our front porch and drank the whole bottle, and I was so pissed. I was so angry, like, you saw, but anyway, and then he came in all drunk, and I’m like, Get out of here. But

 

36:17

it was not what I meant. To go away. Literally. That would

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  36:21

I bet. But it was gone. And I think since that day, we haven’t had it. You know, in the house. People come, bring it, take it with them when they go. But yeah, we don’t have it in the house.

 

36:34

Yeah, and I think that’s a really good point. If you are struggling with being a people pleaser, and you’re afraid to say all alcohol, at least whatever your thing was, that’s got to go and that was my husband’s thing too was wine. But he’s not gonna die. If he has to drink beer or not wine. Yeah, he’s gonna, he’s gonna live, he’ll make it. Yeah, so I think the very least like whatever your favorite thing was, it’s gotta go.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  37:02

Yeah. And telling them that you’re not going to drink just because it’s so easy to need. You know, you want to drink? Of course you do. You’re like physically in withdrawal. It’s a habit, emotions come up. It’s bad enough if they drink in front of you, because they have that jealousy that is real. It’s better if they don’t, like I know, some people like ask their spouses, like, Hey, will you, you know, again, all layers, it’s better. If there’s no alcohol in the house, it’s better if they, you know, don’t drink with you for three weeks. That’s amazing. Some people ask their spouse to just like, hey, if you want to drink, have it when you’re out, and then when you come home, don’t drink, or like, go to some parties by yourself. Some people even just ask their spouse, hey, I’m gonna go to bed early, we, you know, don’t have a drink while I’m up. You can, you can have a drink, watch TV, whatever, once I go to bed, all of those things are sort of on the spectrum of making it easier for you.

 

38:03

Yeah, and it has to work for like your comfort level, and you know, what they’re willing to do and stuff like that. But yeah, if my husband was drinking wine around me, I would have been so angry all the time, I would have been so pissed off and jealous that we would have fought, because I would have been in a bad mood. And so another boundary that I set with him that I think is helpful is a lot of times our partners will drink and they’ll, you know, maybe have one drink and stop. But sometimes they’ll drink and you know, get a buzz on or get kind of drunk or something. And I don’t want to sit and watch my husband be drunk, or hanging out with a drunk person, like one on one. Yeah. So I told him like, you know, you, you do you, whatever you want to do is fine. But if you’re drunk, I’m gonna go do something else. And it doesn’t mean like that I’m mad at you, or you are bad or anything like that. It’s just not fun for me to watch you be drunk? Yeah. So I’m going to do something else. And we have never thought about it. I’ve been forced out a couple of times, and we’ve never thought about it. And it’s been fine. And I think people sometimes feel especially women feel obligated to like, keep everything exactly the same. Keep their lifestyle exactly the same. And you don’t have to sit with your partner. If they’re like, they want to get drunk and watch TV and sit there and just watch like, you can go do something else, and they’re gonna be fine. They will be totally fine.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  39:43

And not only that, but I think I felt a little bit hypocritical like who am I to say that when I was the drunk one so many times and he like took care of me and I know I was annoying, and all the things and you know, you You’re allowed to change and when you change your relationship changes, and that’s okay. And it won’t always be like it is, in the early days, you’re not always going to need the same boundaries, they will loosen. As you get stronger and stronger and more sure, in your conviction, you’re more comfortable around alcohol, but you know, exactly like, tell him for weeks, tell him six weeks, tell him whatever it is. And then once that period passes, you can renegotiate, you know?

 

40:33

Yeah, and we actually talked about my no wine boundary. I was 14 months sober. And it was the summer, you know, and everybody wants to drink wine outside. And my husband was like, How do you feel? I know, you said to never drink wine around you, but like, how do you feel if I just did it and like once in a while, and we talked about what that might look like? And I said, Okay, well, I don’t want you to drink wine around me at a nice restaurant, because of the whole ritual, and I’m going to be so jealous. So let’s play around with like you drinking, you know, those like juice box wines, like the Bota box that come in the little, they’re not little, they’re still like three glasses. But he got those and drank that. So it wasn’t something that I was going to romanticize or be like, particularly jealous of. And we tried it for a couple of months, and like loosened up the boundary and it just didn’t work for me. I didn’t like to smell it. And like, see him drinking wine and and then he decided like, it just wasn’t worth doing that to me and making me feel uncomfortable for stupid one. Yeah. So now we are back to like, no one around me ever. But we did play around with it. So it’s Atlas. So when I tell people I asked my husband to never drink wine around me for the rest of his whole life. They’re always like, like, I could never do that. Well, we played with it a little bit. It wasn’t just like, don’t ever do it ever.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  42:09

Yeah, I mean, I think that my first Christmas, my husband asked me, so I was like, 10 months sober. I mean, you know, it was not early. And my mother was coming over. And my husband was like, hey, it’s Christmas Eve. Are you okay with it if your mom and I have some red wine? And I was just like, whoa. But I said yes, because I didn’t want to rock the boat, or whatever it is. And so basically, it was just my mom, my husband, me and our kids. And they had a bottle of wine in the middle of the table. I mean, I had, you know, my non-alcoholic beverage or whatever. But it just killed me. I was so pissed. I was looking at it, it like, absorbed my whole evening. They were drinking it so fucking slowly. I could like, literally took them like four hours to finish a bottle of wine between them. And I was like, I kept pouring it for them. Because I was like, fucking drink this and get it off the table. And the next night. I mean, it was all I could do to wait, I went to bed early, I put my daughter to bed. I was like texting my sober bestie being like, What the actual fuck, who are these people? And the next night, my husband, but my husband had no idea. I never said anything that night. And the next night he’s like, Oh, well, maybe we’ll have another bottle. I was like, Nope, we’re done. That was, that was not good. And no, have a fucking bourbon. You deal with it. And so now my mom comes and we don’t have anyone you know? Like I said, if they want a beer or a gin and tonic they can but that’s me. That’s because it doesn’t bother

 

43:50

1. Yeah, yeah. And my husband will occasionally have beers in the fridge, and it doesn’t bother me. So everybody’s different. And I would have been exactly the same with a bottle of wine just staring at it. Like, why are they drinking it so slow? And just like thinking about it? Like, like looking at the levels like Yeah,

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  44:12

well then your mind goes, Oh, I can clear the table and just have one sip or whatever. Right? It’s too close. And some people are like, well, it’s their night too. And they Why should my you know stuff interfere? I think it’s like you, I think a bigger group is okay. Like, if it’s not you sitting around a small table with the wine there. Maybe if it wasn’t in my house, it would have been okay, because you can come and go. But especially in the beginning, like the thing is like they can substitute, you know what I mean? Like this thing, even if you want to say it’s just a health kick, it is big and hard and a huge change. So, you know, allow yourself the grace To establish a boundary.

 

45:01

Yeah. And when we feel like, you know, they, they should get to drink whatever they want like blah, blah, blah, that whole thing. Like they’re not going to die, if they have too their Christmas will not be ruined if they drink a beer and not wine, like my husband has really bad heartburn. And I’m the queen of spicy food. It’s my jam. I love spicy guacamole. I love spicy Indian food. And I haven’t had either of those things for many, many months. Because we can’t get that kind of takeout because of this heartburn. I’m surviving, you know, I’m okay. I’m okay.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  45:39

I know. One of my clients is like, her husband is gluten free intolerant. And she loves to bake. But she’s like, Oh, I can’t ask him not to have alcohol in the house. And I was like, How long has it been since you bake banana bread? Like she’s like, Oh, exactly. You know, we do stuff like that for our partners all the time. So were there any other boundaries that you needed to set with him?

 

46:06

I think those were the big ones. Sometimes he would try to pretend that he wasn’t buzzed when he actually was cute. Because I set the boundary of like, I don’t want to hang out with you when you’re drunk. I’m just gonna go do my own thing. But he wants to hang out with me. And he would try to like pretend that he was not super buzzed or like kind of drunk. But we can tell you know, like, I know, I know better than you how you’re feeling?

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  46:37

Yeah. Because I can see it clearly. They’re like, No, let’s have this conversation.

 

46:42

Yeah, you can’t pretend around me. Okay, I can detect it. So I had to have the conversation again, like, I think this is what’s going on. This is the boundary that I said, it’s really important for me. So sometimes, like, boundaries can naturally relax or people can naturally try to like push on them a little without realizing it. And you just have to talk about it again. But yeah, I think it’s critical for me to have those boundaries with him. So that I don’t get jealous. Or just like, do it again, because my mind tells me like now that it’s getting nice out. Oh, it’s so nice out like, you know, you weren’t that bad. Like, are you really never going to drink. And if I didn’t have these boundaries with his drinking, it would be really easy for me to be like, okay, yeah, I’m probably okay.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  47:34

Yeah, I mean, I think the other thing that I had to do, so we talked about, get the alcohol out of your house, tell your partner, set a timeframe. set some boundaries about drinking around you, or like going to bed, early timing, that kind of thing. The other thing I would say is like focus on your triggers that are not just alcohol, because there are a lot of triggers that are emotional, or our resentments or irritations or, you know, kind of doing things we don’t want to do. So we drink to get through them, or to prepare ourselves or whatever it is. 

 

So, you know, some of the things that I had to negotiate with my husband when I quit drinking, was I needed to start going to therapy once a week, you know, I quit drinking, was doing well then had a big anxiety episode. And, you know, got on some medication, but it was really bad. And I was like, Okay, I’m not drinking. I need therapy to figure out how to navigate this. And so what that meant for me was, it was every Thursday night from six to seven, because I worked full time. And my husband needed to pick up both kids. They were different, you know, daycares or whatever, get them home, give them dinner, and I did that like 90% of the time, but it was weirdly difficult for me to ask for him to do it. 

 

And same thing he’s like, so how long are you going to therapy? And then somehow he was also very concerned that I was talking about him and I was like, oh, for fuck sake. This isn’t all about you. It is kind of about you, but I’m never going to tell. But in the end, everything is once you get comfortable with it, it becomes the new normal, like I remember coming home. And instead of you know, me being in the kitchen and Noid cooking, they were like literally around the firepit with hot dogs on a stick making dinner and having s’mores and I was like, oh my god, they think dad’s so much cooler than I am as he is, you know, but like it was good for everybody.

 

49:46

Yeah, and asking for help. is okay. And also not going to things is okay, that is something that I’ve done a lot like we, I had my first sober wedding about six months ago and I didn’t want to go to the rehearsal dinner, because that’s just a drinking party thing. So I didn’t go. And I had my husband go by himself, and it was fine. And he understood. And he was really supportive of like, all the different things I wanted to do at the wedding to make sure I felt comfortable. And so it’s okay to ask for help. Yeah, and if you need to go to therapy once a week, like your husband can take care of the kids that are also his Yes. And it was fine. And it’s good for the kids to have like fun dad night.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  50:32

Yeah. Yeah. And once it’s once a week, you’re like, Oh, my God, this is awesome. I don’t have to,

 

50:37

you know, I have to go to therapy three.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  50:41

Well, no, then it becomes I need to go to therapy. And by the way, there’s a yoga class. And on Sunday, I’m meeting my girlfriends for brunch and a workout. So yeah, but honestly, you doing 90% of the things is what probably makes you want to drink in the first place. Yeah, that it is kind of unequal. A lot of times, not always, but even when women work as much as men, sometimes it is very unequal. So, you know, rebalancing that. So having time to take care of yourself is important and the other thing I found is like, we would go to parties. And once you stop drinking, you’ll find that like, it’s fun. In the beginning, it’s hard, like the first 20 minutes, if you’re an early sobriety, and maybe, you know, you have to make different arrangements. But it’s often that like, you get to a point and you’re like everybody’s drinking, and you’re just done and you’re not longing to stay, but you’re just done, you’re tired, you want to go home, crawl in bed with your Netflix. And so taking separate cars, or asking your partner Uber home, that can be really good, because maybe they’re not ready to leave. And those last hour or two hours can really be hard to sit through. So I think like, just almost acknowledging, hey, I’m probably going to leave at a different time. And if you’re going somewhere with kids, that’s a great excuse to come home. But either way, you know, sometimes it’s okay to leave early. So I think even just discussing that in advance is good.

 

52:18

Yeah, because once you hit that point of, I’m done, I gotta get out of here. Everything after that’s painful. Yeah, and if your partner wants to stay and like do their thing, like my husband can stay up till like three o’clock in the morning partying. And I never could even when I was drinking, I would pass out at like 11 or midnight. And if I had to stay out sober till like three o’clock in the morning, oh, my gosh, I would be such an angry person. So it’s fine. Like you let him you know, you stay out. Have fun. Don’t just wake me up when you get back. And let me know that you’re okay. But yeah, talking about things before they happen. And not like making assumptions that your partner is just going to know. Yes, they’re not going to know, unless you tell them.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  53:05

Yeah, and things bother us that they have no idea about a lot of times. And so even just somehow letting them know in a non angry moment, just you know, I even people I work with, say, okay, tell them if they’re open enough to tell their partner they’re working with me, tell them you’re going to be really irritated. And in the first couple weeks, you’re going to be incredibly tired, you’re going to not need to not cook dinner every night, and maybe just go to bed and read more. And you know, her babysitter like, you know, again, time period, not forever. This is what’s going to happen. This is how I’m going to feel I’m going to need more of your help. Will you do that for me? You know, can I have your support? So helpful?

 

53:53

Yeah, definitely in encouraging them to listen to stuff like this or read Quizlet or just like kind of look at stuff online so they can get a better understanding because my husband, now he understands my experience a little bit better. But two and a half years ago, he really understood his own experience of, you know, being able to stop whenever he felt like it and, and like, weigh the pros and cons and like, decide whether drinking was worth it. And he didn’t understand anything I was going through. He couldn’t, even though he was seeing it every day, he still couldn’t understand. So we have to be, we have to explain like our situation like we’ll have talks about the way that we think about drinking, like he said to me once, he was like, I know this is the ultimate sin. But I’m not going to finish my beer because I’m not trying to get a buzz on and I was like what, like, what are you? What are you trying to do then? So we talked kind of about like our perspective and like our thoughts on finishing your drink and That just helps them understand you better so they can support you more.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  55:03

Yeah. Well, my favorite is when people are like, Oh, I just like it for the taste, especially if they say it around beer. I’m just like, Alright, let me give you a selection of actually good non alcoholic beverages. They taste the exact same. And so if they taste the exact same, but you’re choosing the alcoholic version, you’re choosing it for the alcohol, which I am totally okay with. I really am. But like stop saying it’s about the taste like I’m just like, let’s just be honest here. You know what I mean?

 

55:33

That is such a good point, especially with beers because they are really authentic to the real beer. And those rose A’s.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  55:44

Yeah. What do you love? I love the bubbly. Rosé. The groobie.

 

55:49

Surely Rosé is really good. And they come in cans too. So you don’t have to open the whole bottle. And yeah, and I mostly drink the beers. Yeah. Yeah, the beers are so good. Heineken. Zeros, like, changed everything for the world. Now. Those are everywhere. Yeah. Like when I went to that conference, they had Heineken zeros.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  56:12

Yeah, they were advertising on the Super Bowl, which, oh, my gosh, did you so athletic Brewing Company is my favorite. They’re like, I’m an ambassador for them. But it’s only because they literally are my favorite. And they were advertising on the NCAA Tournament, athletic brewing companies non alcoholic beer. And I was working at a physical therapy the other day, and it was on the side of a bus. And it’s at my grocery store. I’m like, This is awesome.

 

56:40

Yeah, it’s at Whole Foods now. And, and like, you could just give it a try. I know some people that have tried athletic brewing, actually, because that’s what I recommend, because it’s everywhere. And then they stopped drinking. Because the athletic brew beers were good for them. Yeah. And they realized, like, wow, I actually feel horrible when I drink real beer all the time. Yeah, I just naturally stopped drinking.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  57:04

Yeah, that’s awesome. So we talked about boundaries, we talked about clearly communicating what you’re doing, removing the alcohol, sort of switching up some of the typical things in your relationship. One of the things I wanted to talk about was sort of mixing it up, changing the way you always do things in your relationship or finding new things that are fun, because you mentioned that, that wine bars and tastings and drinking like that was what you did for fun. How did you do that?

 

57:40

Yeah, that was scary for me, because we used to just sit or stand in different locations and drink together. And like my husband’s an introvert. And it was hard to get him in that like, that fun kind of connection mood. And I was afraid that I would never have that with him again. So we just tried new projects, like we started with little house projects. And I’ve tried cool things like rock climbing, we’ve done different vacations, where we do hiking, instead of just like, you know, wine tours, and just making sure there’s something to actually do. 

 

I think the worst thing for me is having a bunch of time, like going somewhere and having no plan, because old me would have just sat around and drank all day. And now I need to know what I’m going to do. And like we go to the zoo, and we went, we went to Florida and we saw this like alligator sanctuary thing. And like I held a baby alligator. Like we’re doing all these cool things now that are actually like activities, not just sitting around. So I think that can feel overwhelming when you’re used to doing nothing. And you’re maybe, you’re used to watching TV all the time. That was our other problem. We would watch like six hours of TV a night and just like get drunk. So turn off the TV and do anything else like play a game. Go try a new activity, look on like Groupon, go out with other couples for like, maybe lunch if you don’t want to watch them drink. But yeah, I tried to not watch so much TV with him. Because then I’d just be sitting there thinking about like, how I used to drink and watch TV. And this is not nearly as fun.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  59:35

Yeah, yeah, I know. One of the things that made me the most nervous was going on a date with my husband, which is kind of funny because we’ve been together for literally, I don’t know, 17 years by that point. But in my mind, I just really needed to take the lead in planning it. He would do whatever I asked him to do again like most of our drinking was driven by me. And so I really needed to like think through what we did for dates and propose it to them. So some of the things I found was for me, I was not a Sake drinker. And I love sushi. So going to sushi was easier for me, because in my mind green tea sushi that works really well. Sometimes going to the movies was a lot easier because we had something to watch. 

 

The thing I loved the most in the summer, we always were those people who like hire the babysitter for like 3pm to 8pm because they’re expensive. And why would we waste money while the kids are sleeping like this was like our whole, which we used to daydream doing that. But we would still get the afternoon babysitter, but we would take our books and our blanket and music and go sit by the waterfront. And so I would have my Lacroix and my other beverages and snacks. And he’d have like two beers, but it didn’t bother me because we were people watching and we were looking at the boats, and we were having great conversations, but not like staring at each other over a table. You know,

 

1:01:10

we used to go to these really like divey bars, and like get really cheap food because we’re going to spend a lot on drinks. And then when I stopped drinking, the food became more important. So we started doing more like fine dining. And like having a whole experience and like trying different courses and like, you know, it’s just fancier, they’re like the quality of like, the service that you get is so impressive. And like I just love to watch them and, and so we were distracted by the actual dinner, not just sitting, you know, like the local chain restaurant that we always went to and eating burgers and like not drinking now I can do that fine. 

 

But in the beginning, like doing something nice made it better and like doing other activities where we’re not just like sitting there looking at each other in silence with no drinks is, yeah, that just makes it painful and uncomfortable. And you’re learning you have to learn to connect again. You do? Yeah, you only knew how to like, manufacture this fake instant connection. When you both order your drink, then yeah, like instantly, like, Woohoo, date night. And you have to learn how to get there like on your own. So by doing something else, or like that waterfront thing, I love that idea, that’s a really good idea or going to a movie and not feeling pressure to talk, then you get the connection naturally over time, and you get better at it. But like sitting across from each other, like, it’s time to connect?

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:02:48

Well, and it’s kind of loaded, if you’re going through all these changes, and you’re not ready to talk about it yet. I loved that you talked about vacations, because those are, for me, they were really important to plan. And so you know, I even remember going on Facebook and saying, Hey, I really want to go to Europe next summer. Here’s all the things that we like, like we’ve been to, you know, Venice and Croatian this place and that place we love bike tours and canals and photography and whatever. And I don’t drink. So suggestions open. And so so like, people wouldn’t recommend, you know, Napa and Sonoma, and the French wine region, or, you know, all these places. And that was great, just to get it out there. And to look at, you know, I went to Amsterdam, they have amazing non alcoholic beers at every single place, and bike tours and photography and all the things so that was a great destination. And we went to Santorini Greece, which was incredible; a trip of a lifetime. But like, same time didn’t choose to go on the party boat, right with unlimited drinks, you know, where they have, like, 50 people on there, we chose the one with like, 12 people and a nice dinner, you know, because, you know, you sort of gauge like, what the focus is going to be and what the vibe is going to be like,

 

1:04:13

Yeah, and it feels like you might be missing out. That’s my first thought, like, oh, I can’t go to the wine region and France or like, I can’t go on this fun. party boat. But it’s like, no, I can’t like what, I can’t, it just is what it is like, Yeah, I’ll go on the party boat and I’ll watch everyone drink and be miserable the whole time. Or I could go to the dinner cruise and have a really good meal and actually have a conversation with people and get to bed at a normal time and like have a good memory. Yeah, so I think also just being realistic about what the actual event is because I get jealous all the time. Yeah, like I can see my neighbors in the summer drinking Rose and they’re poor. And I’m just like, oh, you jerks. Like, just sit there and think about it. And it’s like, well, I can’t do that because I’ll drink Rose on the porch and then I’ll come back, drink Rose in the house. And then I’ll drink Rosie all night, and then I’ll cry. And then I might fight with my husband and

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:05:16

then I’ll cry. Yep,

 

1:05:19

yep. Then I’ll get very emotional. And then I might text people. And so I always remind myself of like, the truth. If I did do these things, I was jealous about what would happen for me not what would happen ideally, what would actually happen?

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:05:35

One, then the other thing is like, you can drink non-alcoholic red rose on your porch and read a book and go for a great walk afterwards and sleep through the night. You know what I mean?

 

1:05:47

And I don’t have to cry. Yeah, bonus. Right. Yeah, with not drinking, you actually do stuff. Yeah. And it might seem like it’s boring, or there’s like, all the fun options like you can’t do. But the fun options are just sitting there, like sitting somewhere talking about drinking or like, you know, talking about the same thing you always talk about. And the options that seem not fun. You’re actually doing stuff and making real memories and connecting with people. And those are the memories that you talk about later. Like you don’t reminisce about that, you know, the 140/7 time in 2018, that you sat on your porch and drink wine all night. Like you don’t remember it. Yeah.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:06:35

Well, you know, it’s funny, I was just looking at my calendar. So in a week and a half, my husband’s birthday is on the 15th. And on the 17. I booked us to go paragliding you know, like go to the top of their grave. No, I’m terrified. I am terrified. But I was trying to think of something that would be fun and different, right? We no longer go drinking all the time. And he’s turning 47. So it was like what would be something he would not expect from me, for us to do that would be fun for his birthday. Now not expect for me because I’m fucking afraid of heights. Like I don’t know what I’m doing. I go up those like loop horses. And my leg is like shaking. You know how it’s like those dual ones. So in theory, someone’s going to be behind me. So I feel like they should just like push me off the mountain. But I think it would be really exciting for him. He used to go skydiving when he was like in college. So I really need to not think about this. Because right now I’m getting terrified. But I think that it’ll be fun. Like, if I was drinking, we would have just done a pub crawl, you know?

 

1:07:44

Yep. Yeah. And now you have a memory. And you’re gonna have

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:07:47

not yet so if it goes badly, I’ll check back in and be like, fuck, never do that. Or if I turn around at the top and say I can’t do this.

 

1:07:55

But you’ll still have a memory. I will not after a pub crawl.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:07:59

Yeah. And that adrenaline will probably be a very natural. So anything else that you think that we should talk about in terms of you’re sober and your partner still drinks?

 

1:08:12

I think we should talk about if your partner also has a problem. And they don’t, and they push back really hard. Or they don’t want to make accommodations for you or because that happens to

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:08:26

Yeah, we both have fairly understanding partners.

 

1:08:29

Yeah. And thankfully we were in that situation. But there are other people that might be listening, like, yeah, my husband would never do that. Like my husband doesn’t understand he doesn’t want to stop. So I think my advice for someone in that situation is take your space, don’t sit around and watch them drink the whole time. If they want to get drunk, like they don’t have to get sober just because you don’t drink. But you don’t have to sit there and watch them drink either. So I think just you know, setting the boundary beforehand or, or if you feel uncomfortable doing that, you know doing other hobbies, going to therapy at night or going to yoga class, like things that keep you busy. So you’re not just like sitting there watching it.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:09:15

Yeah. And you don’t have to enable them either, right? I mean, I know a lot of women, if their husbands do sort of drink problematically and sort of, I always call it like have their own wolfy voice like you can tell. They really want you to drink because it normalizes their drinking, they really don’t want you to stop because they’re afraid then you’re going to tell them to stop. And you know, they do try to not so subtly try to draw you back into drinking. And I think then it’s even more important to have an external sober support network, whether that’s online, or in person or a coach or podcast, because you know you really You have to change the messages you surround yourself with. You don’t have to get rid of all your friends or partner who drinks but you definitely need to balance it out with support externally. I think that’s really important too.

 

1:10:15

Yeah, I totally agree. And having people that you can talk to, like, you know, if your partner is spending the whole weekend drinking and like they can’t do anything, or they’re really hungover, like having other people that you can talk to about that, that kind of get where you’re coming from, or can, you know, empathize in some way, or have friends that you can go do stuff with? So you’re not just, you know, sitting around because they can’t do anything?

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:10:44

Yeah, getting more independent, actually really helps. And I’ve certainly known a lot of people whose husbands drink a lot, we’re very resistant to them stopping drinking, and not in the short term, but a year or two later have decided to stop drinking as well. And of course, they’re no promises there. But you can really inspire them when they see you getting healthy and happier and doing more with your life that they’re kind of like, oh, shit, I kind of want to do that, too.

 

1:11:17

Yeah. And then they feel like they have the support. They have someone who can kind of show them the way and like, it’s not as hard for them. If we did it first, you know, like, my husband backed off so much from his drinking when I stopped and it wasn’t right away. I mean, he did for those three weeks that I asked, but after like several months, like he just naturally cut back and over the two years that I haven’t drunk now he drinks even less than he did a year ago. Like he’s just naturally, he’s not interested anymore, because I’m not doing it.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:11:48

Yeah, yeah. And you’re doing more interesting things. But there is no question that it is hard. So sometimes in online groups, you can find other people whose spouses also drink a lot when they’re trying to quit, because it does really help to know you’re not alone in it. And even when your partner is drinking a lot, and you’re super annoyed, having someone to message who is also sober. Your partner drinking a lot can also be a great reminder why it’s not as romantic and glamorous as we think it is, like watching them stumbling or hungover or not remembering stuff. I mean, you think it’s all a good time, but there is nothing. That’s a good time about a brutal hangover.

 

1:12:34

Yeah, I call that sad drinking. Yeah, and seeing, I tell my therapist, like, Oh, don’t worry about me. I’m not going to be jealous or anything, because it’s all sad drinking that I’m going to be seeing, not the romantic drinking. So yeah, it definitely reminds you like, yeah, I don’t miss that. I don’t want any of that in my life.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:12:55

Yeah. The other thing I would say is that it’s pretty natural for your partner to get nervous about whether you’re going to change a lot and no longer want to be with them, which sounds weird, but my husband told me he felt that way. And I’ve heard it from other people, too. Also, if you start conversing with a lot of people online, even if they’re women that you haven’t chatted with before, if you go to meetings, I mean, there are people that your spouse doesn’t know, and sometimes they get nervous about that, too. I mean, I think it’s important just to be a little bit open about that, if you can just be like, Oh, we’re just chatting about how you know what drinks we’re going to have this weekend, or that we’re not sure what to do on Saturday night, or we’re just going to get together and talk about what it feels like to do XYZ. You know, just understanding that they get nervous about that. And you wouldn’t be too if your spouse was suddenly spending two hours online with someone you didn’t know. You’d be like, Who the fuck are you talking to? You know?

 

1:14:03

Yeah, definitely. And I try to like, bring my husband into my friendships a little bit and like, you know, let my friends get to know him a little bit or like have him kind of see maybe videos that like, Oh, this is my friend this. This is the one that I talked to you about all the time because like you go from just drinking all the time and being miserable to now you have this amazing community and are so happy. And they’re Yeah, they’re probably like, why do you spend like a bazillion hours talking all these people like and maybe feeling jealous or uncomfortable or nervous

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:14:37

or left out? Yeah, like Yeah, I’m right here. I do the same thing. Like I share kind of who I’m talking to you like, oh, it’s Ingrid and Kim and we’re getting together and we’re going to brunch here’s a picture we took you know, he I went to AA for four months and he was definitely pretty resistant to that. I think because he was like, Are you going to change into this persona that I’ve seen in movies, you know what I mean? It’s natural. And I think like, when you have babies, people always told me this, like anything that you feel good or bad. Just wait for weeks because it’ll change, like, don’t get too invested in how you feel now. And I tell that to people all the time, like, they’re like, oh, my god, how am I going to go on a trip in four months, and I’m like, you are going to go through three evolutions between now and four months from now, you’re going to feel so much stronger, so much more different, so much confident things that bother you now, won’t bother you then. And the same is true of your spouse, like it is normal to feel rage and irritability and frustration and fear that your marriage might be over to your husband in the first month. Like if you feel that you’re right on track, you know?

 

1:15:53

Yeah, I was afraid my husband would leave me for someone more fun, that could drink and party. And now he has more fun with me now that I don’t drink.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:16:03

Well, this was an awesome conversation. I know, there’s so much more there that we could talk about. But hopefully, if you’re listening to this, you’ve gotten some ideas about how to navigate that period of time when you’re not drinking, if your spouse still drinks, just some ideas. And just don’t be scared, you know, to talk to them about it or to ask for what you need. You don’t have to tell them everything or air your deep, dark secrets. But you do have to be more open in asking for what would help you. Because otherwise, it’s going to be really hard on you. And it doesn’t have to be that hard.

 

1:16:42

Yeah, they’re gonna continue to treat you the same. If you don’t tell them that things are changing.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:16:49

Yeah. And you’re allowed to evolve.

 

1:16:53

It’s normal. And I’m sure they have to like, we like, we were saying with the guacamole and the gluten free stuff. Like, we don’t think about that. And it should be the same with alcohol.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:17:05

Yeah, absolutely. All right. Well, it’s always so good to talk to you. Do you want to tell people I’m sure they’re gonna want to follow up? So tell folks about your podcast and your website and your, you do everything YouTube Instagram Live. So where can people find you?

 

1:17:21

So if you search for Sober Powered, you’ll find me all over the place. That’s my show, my website, my YouTube, my Instagram. And reach out if you have any questions.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:17:33

Awesome. Thank you so much, Gill.

 

Casey McGuire Davidson  1:17:56